Richard.H
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Posts posted by Richard.H
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Guilty as charged!
Oh yeah for sure. But then again, it's kinda fun I think! I mean as long as people are not overdoing it...it would enrich the conversation I'd say.
When I speak to very well-spoken people I sometimes feel like I'm not even talking to a person...while it does sound very nice and intellectual it makes me feel a little bit distant.
When people are using these "parasitic" words or phrases it makes them appear more human. There is more familiarity going on. That makes me feel closer.
But again - if it's being too overused it has exactly opposite effect on me.
Bottom line, it's fun, just don't overdo it!
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I believe this to be of paramount importance on the path to becoming fluent.
I do this even when I only know a single sentence. Obviously this cannot be considered "thinking" but if you know the word or expression for the given situation you best conjure it up in your mind. It trains your brain in switching between languages. I find it then easier to speak faster. Basically you stop trying to translate foreign words in your head because your head is already used to the foreign words.
I think, and I might be wrong but, if you don't think in the language you're learning then you will always have to do that additional step of translating in your head.
Anyway, give it a shot! It doesn't hurt
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I have never heard about InterLingua, but I would love to try to see if I could comprehend some of it. I am going to try to find it online. That would be cool if more people did learn an internationally known language. Just think of the possibilities if we could all understand each other.
You mean like English?
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Wow never heard of it! I only know of Esperanto - (if you don't know) an artificial language that was suppose to be universal language but didn't catch on.
@*Beatrish* thanks for the link!
Is this like a real thing? People actually study this, or is just another attempt just like Esperanto?
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Well, the most awkward thing I ever did to study a language was actually when I first got to China. There, when going out, I always took my translator with me. And then, in the Bars & Discos, I translated everything from English to Chinese and showed them the output on my translator. Then, after reading my message, they wrote down their answer (with a special pen) directly on the screen of my little translator and I translated it back to English :grin: This was the only way I could communicate with Chinese people when I first visited China about 10 years ago:=) I do speak Chinese now and this definitely makes things much easier, hehe :=)
That is totally my method!
I do the same exact thing when my language skills fall short!
Another thing I do, but it's not really all that wack, is I make my friends (who are the natives of whatever language..) to teach me some really old school pick up line, or some really wack phrase. Of this I would then know only the rough translation, then I would just say it to people and have fun with the reactions.
One such phrase in Chinese (which linguaholic may know) is 吃豆腐 - this could roughly be translated as sort of innocent "sexual harassment." Basically not the hard core kind. This phrase really does put smiles on Chinese people when you use it at the right time! Ahh, good times.
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I usually have some basic words and phrases down by the time I get to speak to natives.
And if I mispronounce something? Well, that's great! Because then the native will correct me and I know what to focus on - i.e. I discover where I'm messing up. This leads to gradual improvement.
Trying and failing will lead to gradual improvement. Doing nothing will lead to nothing. If you don't use the language - even if it's just a single word - you are practicing nothing and so you won't improve.
So just jump into it head first! Whatever happens you will learn and handle it better the next time around!
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Hey I usually go through the following programs to study a language:
Beginner:
-Pimsleur and Michel Thomas during my commute to work. This is good because it is during "dead" time. Pimsleur is especially very good at getting a base, functional level of conversation down. Michel Thomas is okay but better than nothing to help during this "dead" time.
-I use Rosetta Stone a little for vocab but its not the greatest - money or time wise.
Intermediate/Advanced:
-Anki flash cards - EXTREMELY helpful to learning vocabulary. It is a spaced repetition program that will program the cards to reappear at a specified interval for you to be able to retain. There are several shared decks available in each language or you can create your own.
-Read newspapers: any new vocab I put into an Anki deck
-Read books: start off with children's stories and work up. If you have a kindle you can get a english translation dictionary and every word you highlight is translated and saved. Later on I go and put these words in an Anki deck.
-For listening practice I watch TV, movies and TedTalks.
-Grammar books of course.
-Skype one on one tutoring - definitely the method I've progressed the most with. I use http://www.italki.com/?ref=1555469 which basically connects students and native speaking teachers. You can take advantage of exchange rates so the avg lesson is about $10/hour which pretty much beats any other paid course you can get. You can also connect with other students and exchange languages on Skype for free.
Best of luck on your language learning!
I basically have to copy this one for the most part!
This is for the most part what I do.
I'm not fan of Michal Thomas as I find it rather boring, though I can see how other people might find it useful. But Pimsleur I love, it's really great to keep up your basics of conversation when you don't get to practice with natives.
Grammar books for structured and organized grammar learning.
Rosetta Stone, this I have never used as it doesn't seem to be my cup of tea.
But Anki, OMG, I could never get Kanji/Hanzi down without it! The best thing for vocab.
TV and other "natural" sources for practice are of course awesome.
Never tried the Skype thing though. There was always some native speaker somewhere with whom I could practice with!
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I started to become interested in languages when I was graduating from high school. I was so sick and tired of preparing for all the final tests that I'd rather do anything else.
So, of course, I did my laundry - hahaha
When I was done cleaning my room later, I decided I needed something more. I realized the situation was so bad that I'd even be happy to *study* something else.
I figured - well, I kinda like Anime, right? Japanese sounds kinda cool. I'll learn just a little bit. So, I went online and got started.
It wasn't until few years later when it got really out of control and started with Chinese and even tried out some Korean as well!
To answer the question, it all started when I was 17. But I didn't get serious until I was like 20.
I never had any aspirations to learn "as many languages as possible" though. I will be perfectly satisfied with 5 or 6.
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This is THE way to go!
If you don't enjoy it don't do it! I know easier said than done...but true nonetheless!
Do what you love, if you can do it with a friend - AWESOME!
And being able to do it regularly....what's better?
Always strive to make it fun!
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Well,
I know how hard it is to focus. I'm not as bad as you are - most likely, but I kinda understand where you are coming from. For me I have deep love for several languages too and I faced the same problem as you - decide which one. I kept going in circles (for your info, I was doing pimsleur as well, not the other stuff you've mentioned though). It wasn't going anywhere.
Every time I focused on one language I quickly started to forget the other ones. At the time these languages were Japanese, Chinese, Korean.
My final solution - which has been working amazingly for almost a year now, was to drop one language and study two at the same time. Since Korean was the last on the list it had to go (this is temporary though, I'll master it yet) and now I'm studying both Japanese and Chinese.
It was painful to let Korean go but now I feel like I'm really fully utilizing my time when I study both J and C. I feel the progress being made in both of the languages.
So my recommendation would be study both at the same time. Just try it out, you can always drop one at any time and come back to it later in the future!
Either way, good luck buddy on your journey!
Richard
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Yeah I agree with everyone, this is common for every country.
I myself make such mistakes, LOL.
So no worries!
It really comes down to whether you care to speak properly or not. I don't think it's the lack of education, unless there are some special circumstances...
Well, that's my two cents anyway..
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Although Pimsleur does involve repeating words and phrases, unless the OP left out some information about the method, this isn't the same. Pimsleur is mainly translation and repetition, and also includes some basic information about pronunciation and grammar.
Wait you're saying this "active listening" is just repeating the sentence without any context (grammar, translation, etc)?
I guess I would have to listen to the actual thing to have a clear picture..
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Hahaha, that's cool!
I dreamed in all my languages I believe. But it's really as random as it's fun.
So don't give up, one day (or night?) when you expect it the least....bam, you'll have your Spanish dream!
Keep dreaming!
R.
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If I'm not mistaken this is basically Pimsleur's approach/method right? Repeating phrases and words over and over again.
It won't really teach you the language - meaning grammar and reading and all that - but it is a big step towards fluency early on. By fluency here I mean the ability to express yourself, react fast, and sound natural.
I mean you could reach native speaker level fluency without ever touching any textbooks. But usually these kinds of people don't know how to read and write.
Anyway this is really how I got started with most of my linguistic adventures. If you're looking up how the words are written as you're going through your "active listening" course then I think it will make an excellent start. Also, based on my experience, it will make any further learning of the language that much easier.
Cheers
Richard
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Unless you really like to be corrected often & face-to-face, I wouldn't recommend this. I think most would have better success learning pinyin on their own. There are so many excellent audio programs available now, and they are so much lower pressure than a teacher, it's hard for me to imagine not taking advantage of it.
While I agree, I don't argue with results. I got a really good head-start by spending a few hours with a native and getting better understanding of what the hell is going on. It was that much easier to take off on my own later.
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Hey everyone!
I have a few questions for people studying Japanese - or people interested in studying Japanese. I know there is a dedicated part of the forum to Japanese language only, but I wanted to hear opinions of people who are just thinking of learning Japanese as well!
What is your biggest challenge when you started out? Or what's your biggest fear of starting out? How were you thinking of starting to learn the language? What were your studying materials lacking?
To summarize I guess, what were your first studying materials and what were your initial snags/problems you've run into?
Basically I'm trying to figure out what are the most typical problems beginners have to face. Any and all opinions are welcome!
All the best
Richard
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こんにちは！
おっ！みんななかなか日本語出来るじゃないでしょう！
僕はリチャードと申します。よろしくお願いします！
頑張りましょう！
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I love Pimsleur! It's how I first got started.
What you guys say is totally true though - 1. it is expensive 2. it is rather formal.
I don't have a problem with either though for the following reasons:
1. The quality is well worth the price. It really does teach you to talk and listen. Which is the corner stone of any language.
2. While in Anime you'd often use informal talk in Japan you would find yourself often using the formal talk. Unless you become friends with somebody...then you could switch to informal of course, but you will start conversations in the polite form 99% of the time. Besides they will teach you the less formal form later in Pimsleur 3? Maybe already in #2...not sure! Not to mention you will pick up most of the informal talk from Anime and whatnot.
All in all, Pimsleur was my survival guide in Japan. I had absolutely no problems getting around. It was tough having conversations above basic level but if you incorporate vocab you pick up from watching Anime and such you'll do fine.
Unfortunately it will be inevitable to move away from Pimsleur and hit the books to really learn the grammar and of course the writing. But as a starting point Pimsleur was pure gold. Especially if you're going for a vacation to Japan and you want to learn some basic phrases and vocab to get around. It does really help.
I understand though, the price is a big thing, so if you're just a student it could pose a serious problem. You could ask your parents for it as a gift though. Besides should still be cheaper than any actual Japanese courses. But I guess that depends on where you're located.
So if you can afford it - awesome starting point!
Cheers
Richard
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Chinese is actually not using any Alphabet at all. This is a common misconception about the Chinese language. Chinese is using characters and in general one character is representing one syllable. In ancient Chinese, one character mainly represented one word but this changed a lot over time. So you might wonder how many characters are there in Chinese? There are actually thousands of characters! You need to know about 3000-4000 characters in order to read a newspaper, but you have to take into account that you will need to know an endless amount of character combinations as well, as words are generally made up of at least two characters. There are some 1-character-words as well, but as mentioned previously, this is not the standard in Modern Mandarin Chinese. I could go on forever with talking about Chinese, so if you have some specific questions, feel free to ask :=)
kind regards
Lingua
Although true this wasn't exactly motivational
Hi! So a couple years ago I started trying to learn Mandarin, but I found learning all the different tones really intimidating and gave up pretty quickly. Now I'm thinking about taking it up again, but I'm unsure how to get over that initial learning hurdle so that I can stay motivated. Those who have successfully stuck with learning Mandarin/Cantonese, how difficult did you find it was to learn all the tones and pronunciation. What advice do you have to someone who's feeling intimidated and doesn't really know where to begin?
Get a native speaker, or somebody capable of teaching chinese to help you out with the tones, and your first characters.
A basic course of Chinese should get you started (if you don't drop out lol) and then you could pick up on your own. This is what I did. I had native speaker as a teacher and she taught me the tones and some characters. This basic course was really basic and it was only one class a week - too slow for me. So I quickly moved to studying on my own. But that initial help with the tones was essential for me. Since it was my first time to encounter a tone based language it was nearly impossible for me to comprehend what the bleeb was going on at first.
Looking back it's not *that* difficult. It just takes time getting used to since it's so different. Same for the characters. After you learn a couple hundred you will hit this *critical mass* (that's what I like to call it) and it will become much more easier for you to learn new ones. The first few hundred though - ouch! Hell on earth!
Just jump into it head first, stick with it and you're golden!
Richard
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Ideally you want a native speaker to help you out with the tones. You can learn them by yourself of course, but it would take a lot work off your shoulders if you had someone fluent help you out with the basics.
Then start learning words, phrases. Build on that.
I think - unless you're in China or other Chinese speaking country - having some quality audio lessons is of utmost importance. It's better to know a few words and speak them well than many poorly spoken. It's not just the tones you gotta watch out for, there is many similar sounds in Chinese (q, ch, j,...). It's just as important to tell these apart as it is to pull off the tones correctly.
Learning the characters is important if you're aiming to truly master the language. But like I said, the audio and the right pronunciation should be your priority. At least that's what payed off for me the most.
Happy hunting
Richard
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I want to agree with the most people here and say it's not quite possible.
But I must point out that we did not establish what does "learning a Kanji" mean...does this mean all the readings + writing + origin + .... in other words complete mastery or simply remembering how the Kanji looks like?
If it's just the meaning then perhaps it might be possible...but than again (I don't know about others but) I would forget for sure...reviewing 2000 characters on daily basis is just not quite scalable.
So no I don't think it's possible unless you are a genius.
I don't mean to discourage people from trying this crazy method, but it's kinda like as if I published my own method "Learn 2000 Kanji in 2 days", simply learn 1000 on day one, then 1000 the next day...bam! you're done. Congratulations, you've have mastered in just 2 days what takes many years to master!
But in all honesty, if you can pull it off then you have my respect! I've tried this method and failed.
Those were my two cents..
Good luck guys!
Richard -
Very cool man! Thanks, had no idea about this!
I'll be happy to take a closer look!
ありがとう
R.
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Welcome to the forum, Richard.
I'm also learning Japanese currently. I hope we can help each other, interested in some of the tricks you've learned. I hope you choose to share some of it in the Japanese Language Forums. Korean is second to Japanese for me, I'm really into the music and watching Korean dramas, so I was kind of interested in that, after I am more fluent in Japanese.
あ！いいね！是非練習しよう！
Could you shoot me a link to that forum? Is it a subforum over here or an entire forum somewhere else?
Hi Richard
Welcome to linguaholic.com! It's a big pleasure having you here. I am also studying Chinese and I have some very basic knowledge about Japanese. Both languages are really fascinating! It's pretty impressive that you do all your studying at home! I think it is pretty hard to motivate yourself when doing self-study, that is why I like to join classes from time to time or maybe consider an immersion program or so!
Best wishes
Lingua
那麽，你好！啊，是啊，你已經告訴我了！很好！
Oh trust me I know. Sometimes it's pretty tough and frustrating. But I usually figure out all the snags via internet because often even natives don't have straight answers! Talk about frustrating, right?
如果你想跟我一起練習。。。。send me a PM hahaha. Still not there yet
Anyway, thanks for the welcome guys! And sorry for replying a little late - forgot to check this page! >.>'
Cheers
Richard
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I'm not saying my method is the best by any means but here it is:
1. Pimsleur - I get the pronunciation and basic words and phrases down.
2. Google up what are the best books for that language. Focusing on grammar and vocab. Also writing.
3. Of course practice with natives at every chance I get. If I can't then movies and tv shows are the next best thing.
4. Anki - flashcard type software for reviewing vocab. Highly recommended. Would be lost without it.
That's pretty much it. Nothing too elaborate. But I do believe the right books and the corner stone of self-study. The trick is to find them.
Good luck!
Richard
Do you have words for "yes" and "no" in your language?
in Language Learning
Posted
Oh yeah I hate this about Chinese.
The closest you can get to a universal "yes" would be 對 - this translates as "correct". So it's not really yes but you can generally reply to most yes-or-no questions.
There is no universal word for no as far as I know. Negative reply (or "no") would depend on how the question was asked. Which is a bummer when you're starting out. As you get better I'd say it makes the language more "colorful".
That's the only language I know of that doesn't have a direct word for "yes" and "no"