Saholy

I currently have a tutor who is not professional but recently graduated very high in her class from a private school that taught several different languages and only communicated in the nations 2nd language (an international language) so as to help the students become fluent. Since she is also trying to learn my language and has succeeded in being able to express herself very clearly, we have decided to do this 'language tandem' as one post called it. We both ask each other questions for clarity on one anothers language and because our expressions are at a similar level, we can comprehend well the meaning of those hazy expressions we have been having trouble grasping. Like two people on a tandem bike must be in sync with their movement, I think this way of learning works best when both parties are at the same level of language learning so that they can be in sync with the learning experience.

Yes, I agree. American schools should be teaching their young students a second language, preferably Spanish and then as the students grow they should be allowed to choose another language of choice. Since they have still not succeeded to provide this I doubt my other desire will ever come to fruition: that the children be taught the basics of a character language, like Chinese. With the growth of international business, I think this would not only aid them in developing their learning skills but might also come in handy with future employment. Children absorb so quickly and tutors who could come in under the guidance of the educator would be easy enough to find. Many third world countries teach a 2nd and even a 3rd language and their resources are far more limited than what most Western worlds have. To say one is American and English is the international language so why bother is unwise and narrow minded. The world is changing all the time and the American children need to be taught how to grow with those changes.

Yes! Book learning and practical application can feel like completely different languages sometimes! Because of this some disregard one or the other but I feel both are necessary even though frustrating. Book learning makes us speak formally and native speakers in general may not use such a 'high language'. Idiomatic expressions, slang, and accent can maybe it very hard to understand. However, if the learner attempts to speak this way it often doesn't sound right to the native hear. For example, to the learner's ear and American pronounces 'water' like 'wader'. But when a learner says, 'Wader' and not 'water', the D is often over pronounced making it not sound right. I think the key is to humbly fight through the initial language barriers. After your prepared introduction, (no matter how good you feel you are at the language) which will sound something like this, 'I am still learning the language, i apologize if I make a mistake...' (then continue) I find my listeners open their ears more and seem to try harder to understand. They also won't switch to my native language thinking they are helping me by doing that. They will continue to try to speak with me testing out how much I understand and then go from there. This method has worked so far but after over 5 years of my current language I still struggle with it when I meet a new person. We are relocating to a new area that has a different dialect and uses more French, so we need to improve yet again in another language area.

My husband and I traveled to other countries for volunteer construction work. We finally ended up staying in several locations for a prolonged period of time and learning the local language (as opposed to the colonized language) drew us closer to the local people and therefore made our separation from family and friends back home more bearable. Our latest venture has taken us to a country where we have been for 5 years. This has been our longest stay anywhere but it has also been the hardest language. We can now be considered fluent by international standards however we still have much to learn by local standards.

Yes! I think the rumors are true: it is easier to learn another language once you have one or some under your belt. One of the reasons is this: you learn to read body language, you learn how to access your memory banks for information you already know that will help you use process of elimination in order to help you decipher what you are hearing and lastly, you learn what key words are really important to learn for communication. There are about 100 words that one needs to learn in any language in order to begin communicating. If you are attempting a Latin based language, you already have hundreds of words that you know - you only need to change the way you are pronouncing or hearing them! Once you get passed these barriers to language learning, it becomes much easier to learn the next one. Some even suggest learning two new languages at once. But that might be a better subject for a future post. ;-)

Does anyone out there speak Malagasy? We can use this thread to converse if you like. Here is something to start us off, if there is anyone out there who is interested:

Manao ahoana Tompko?

Inona no vao vao?

I Saholy ny anarako.

Iza mo ny anaranao?

Avy aiza ve ianao?

Avy etat-unis aho.

Mianatra miteny Malagasy ve ianao sa efa mahay?

Nianarako ny fiteny Malagasy 5 taona.

My first 2nd language I attempted to learn was Spanish. While I still find interest in this, it was many years ago when I was in my early 20s and I moved to an area that did not use it and thus lost all of my skill level except for a word pool which I have kept. Before that, I had some exposure to American Sign Language at the age of 5, but did not develop the skill until in my late 20s when beginning to use it for work. The person who I was close to was a very good lip reader and so our family only used limited sign when speaking with that person. This is something I regretted later. I think all language should be encouraged at younger ages as the retention levels are much higher the younger you are. But age is no barrier to language learning, it just makes it more of a challenge.

One of the things that I have found most challenging in any language is getting the sense of certain idiomatic expressions or proverbs. For example, in English we might say, 'That's like the pot calling the kettle black'. Most languages have something similar that you have grown up with and therefore comprehend the meaning but when it comes to explaining it to others it can be vague. What do you think? Are there any tricks to learning idiomatic expression and or proverbs in a new language? Do you have a favorite expression in a certain language that you would like to share?

I think that learning language through movies is a great way to get used to comprehending the language despite accent differences. One of my favorite films to show to friends who are trying to learn English is an older film called, 'Man from Snowy River'. The reason I think this is a good film to learn English to is because it is not only an interesting story line but it has 3 variations of an English accent; Australian, British and American. I think if a person can watch this and comprehend the English despite all the accent variations, then they have a good handle on the language.

I have not tried this one yet, but I am a big fan of flashcards. The book Madrigals Magical Keys to Spanish suggest using flashcards. I also took an accelerated language course for sign language and they had us using flash cards. I think this quick method of learning is nice because you can partner up with someone. Also you can carry them with you wherever you go.

We just had a similar experience when we went home on vacation. My husband and I would be speaking about something and look at each other and have to use a word in our new language that just fit better than any word we could think of in our first language. People would look at us like 'what did that just mean' and then we would try to explain it but couldn't. I think it is cool when you begin to think in the language that you are learning. Some words are so unique you cannot find a compensation for its meaning and thus you begin to prefer certain ways of saying things in your new language. I think its a good sign. At least I hope so anyways.

Has anyone tried 'Live Mocha' yet? It is a free online language app with access to native speakers and over 35 languages. It can be found at: http://livemocha.com/ Their method is structured on: Whole-Part-Whole learning. This breaks down learning into 3 parts: demonstration, deconstruction and practice. I have just found it now and am signing up so do not know the results yet but wanted to share it with everyone before I forgot.

YES YES YES! I practically tripped over my keyboard trying to answer this question. I come from a supposedly 'developing country' who still does not insist on elementary levels learning even the secondary language of the country. Meanwhile, I have visited several 'third world' countries and many of the native speakers are able to speak simple greetings to me in English. They walk to school with no shoes but are able to converse with me and yet, my friends children can only say words like, 'burrito'. It is a subject that really troubles me. Not only is language learning good for young minds as a hole, it will be a necessary element of the young adults life as they attempt to find their place in the working world. It is a grave injustice not to teach foreign language in primary education. There is no reason to not do it other than it must not fit into the budget or their are not enough native speakers qualified to teach it.

Any level three language would be the hardest in my opinion. You have level three languages that use different breathes while pronouncing the syllables. Or they might have Cyrillic text as opposed to the Roman alphabet. That being said, the Latin language while supposedly the easiest strike me as very intimidating because many people are fluent in them and therefore extremely critical. I think when you attempt a difficult language, the native speakers may show more appreciation and sympathy because they know it is difficult and not many can do it. It is difficult to use a language like Spanish because so many speak it fluently and there are so many accents and dialects that you stand the chance of constantly being corrected depending on who you are attempting to speak with.

When I am at a seminar for a Malagasy sign language seminar, my notes are a mess. If I write in a language, then I will have a mix of ASL idiomatic expression for certain signs like 'Pah', or I might have Malagasy, or I might throw in some English. This mess has caused me to start taking notes in pictures. I am a big fan of 'mind mapping' or 'idea mapping'. Especially if one is dealing with sign language. I have gotten better at writing in Malagasy and it is a goal of mine to be able to write a story or a poem in the language. As far as French goes, my writing ability is NIL. :-(

One thing I have found that has varied in travels is peoples opinions of accent. I personally love a good accent but some find it to make the speaking of the language inaccurate. The English language has so much variety in accent that I don't think one can really claim to pronounce certain vowels the right way. My name is said in several different ways depending on what country one is from. I think my favorite accent is probably a Scottish one. What about you? Do you have a favorite accent? Or do you feel if a person is a fluent speaker they should not have one?

Thanks! I have not tried it yet, but will try downloading it immediately. I am also looking for some freeware for my nieces who will be spending a few months in Thailand this winter. I have bought them a book online that helps with the alphabet and they have also bought a few things on their own. It sounds like this software wouldn't help with Thai but if you have anything that would, I would love to have it.

We might all have 'reasons' for wanting to learn a new language such as employment, volunteer work, relationships, etc. However, I have found those reasons are not always the thing that motivates me to enjoy language learning to the point where I want to do it. I think what motivates me to keep learning a language is to find a native speaker of that language whom I really want to be close friends with. When you are with a person whom you want to get to know desperately and cannot it drives you crazy and this is the best motivation. You are in a humbled state, not a proud one (often a case in an environment where you might be with a group of like-minded peers). So you do not care by what means you learn the language as long as you get the result you need. When you are walking with this friend you are gesturing and pointing to things and maybe even drawing pictures to try to figure it out. By using all these means to communicate I think your brain does not easily forget what you have learned. And the entire process becomes an enriching experience. So, my best motivation is having a good friend who speaks that language.

Thanks! I haven't tried that one yet. I'm not sure how much it will help with translating such things as proverbs that have a hidden meaning, but I'm sure it will help when it comes to everyday translation. I have tried google translate but it does not yet translate the language I'm trying to learn. It helps me with my French though (a secondary language I'm trying to learn).

The 3 month language course I last took was free of charge. However, when I was training to test for sign language in the states I paid about a 100.00 a setting to work with a tutor to help me. I have spent countless 100s of dollars on language books over the years. I think it is essential to invest in your language learning. However, this being said, the best teacher is working with native speakers and letting the language become natural. A person only needs to set the foundation with classes and books and then allow themselves to build on what they've learned with practical experience. That being said, we have friends (our language instructors) who took 3 month classes once a year to ensure that their language was continuing to improve and they weren't stuck in a rut of language errors. We have all heard language users who have continued to mis-pronounce words despite the fact that they have lived in a country a long time. This is one of my personal fears and so your post has caused me to reconsider if I shouldn't take up another class to brush up on my skill in a more disciplined environment. The French Alliance here charges about 60.00 for a 3-month course.

I have found several Arabic audio books by searching on Youtube. Since I do not speak Arabic, I am not sure which ones are the best. But here is one that popped up in full:

There are also some in several parts if your browser is slower. Thanks to your post I found the Quran in Malagasy! Thanks! There is a huge Muslim culture here and I will find this very interesting. There are some words that we use that are directly from the Arabic language years ago when the first immigrants came over, so it might be interesting to delve into.

Is sign language universal??

There was an attempt awhile back to make a universal sign language but I think the development of it has fallen through although some deaf individuals may use it with international friends. Since facial expression and placement of sign is universally part of the grammar structure of sign language, many deaf people of other countries only need am matter of hours before they begin trying to understand one another. This  might be similar to those of us with Latin based language's in common; we try to search for the words that have similar meaning. As has been mentioned on the posts already there are 100s of sign language around the world. I think that part of the difference is because many deaf do not school and began using 'home signs'. Those home signs began to develop in to the countries own sign languages. Then, for some countries who received volunteer help like South Africa for instance; signs from different nations began to meld together to form a unique sign language all their own. They might have one sign that is common in Ireland, another that is commonly used in England, and then another that is only based on local custom. For example, in the U.S. most people associate coffee with a coffee grinder, and so this is the sign in ASL for coffee. However, in Madagascar, many people purchase their coffee in gargottes (little snack shops) and so they get a tin cup with a spoon. Thus, the sign for coffee in Malagasy sign language is a cupped hand with your pinky finger stirring the sugar and milk. For both countries the sign becomes very clear. Then there are initialized signs, as was alluded to in another post; for Malagasy the word for justice is Rariny and it is signed with an R shaped hand. However, in other countries the word may begin with another letter or it may not be initialized at all as in the case of the ASL sign for justice. Regardless of which sign language one might use, it is universally regarded as a really 'cool' language for lack of a better expression. I often say sign language is like 'seeing' language. It is 3D as it were. Once you begin learning sign, you won't want to go back!

Thanks, I have found that physical humor is easier to grasp at first than idiomatic expression or puns. Some local artisans have voiced over old Charlie Chaplain films so that you can hear voices while it plays. Since the films are very clear because they are so physical, it is easy for me to see the point of humor the local language is trying to make. Watching it with friends has been a fun way to develop this part of our language skills.

I actually interviewed for a job once where you needed basic Spanish, got the job, and then turned it down because it was working for a medical facility interpreting for sick clients. Ethically, I just didn't feel right accepting it due to the fact that my language was only basic and I could do someone harm. This being said, I have often wondered if it would have been a gateway for me to become proficient. They begged me to come because they had no one else. This also made me wonder if something wasn't better than nothing. Since, that job I have had a job as a sign language interpreter and the requirements to be able to work in the profession are very high. Therefore, all and all I think I made the right decision years ago. But these are some of the types of decisions employers have to make. They must provide a service and yet the quality of the service is at times limited.

After years of trying to learn different languages, we have found that the most difficult thing to obtain to is humor in the new language. One of our instructors suggested we learn at least two good jokes to help 'break the ice' when we are trying to gain more experience with common language interchanges. There are many different ways which one might be able to gain more of an understanding of what is considered culturally humorous in another language. What do you think? Have you been able to grasp humor in your new language? If so, how have you done so?